Venus Pipes & Tubes Limited IPO Message Board (Page 9)

@Lokes.. Edelweiss Guest option did not allow SHNI applications when tried at 3:45 pm, may be they did not allow sHNI applications at all even before 3 too.

In Zerodha what is the confirmed cutoff time apply as sHNI with UPI ???

And hats off to you to answer the same question 100 times. Usually people included me get tired of giving same answers to same questions repeatedly, but you do not...

@Lokes Sir,
Sir Please Provide Link Article of SHNI & BHNI Details. and how to apply SHNI & BHNI.

Thanks Sir.. !

@avenue: in zerodha, i applied at 3.40pm in HNI and got upi mandate request. So hopefully they are allowing till 3.59pm. We can try in any ipo now that way :)
i applied in delhivery ipo from zerodha upi to test hni application in zerodha :)

I also get tired sometimes so its upto mood to reply :)
For new rules, it will take time anyways for everyone to be familiar. And it will be tough for us also to answer the question regarding approx allotment as per approx lots applied, since we also won't be knowing until we know each category breakup also. So only some calculated guesses can be made based on experiences, and experience will keep getting better with time. And more people in future will apply only 14lot and 67/68 lots in SHNI BHNI later in good ipos, like in retail now 1 lot only, once they will get to know things.

@R.K : there is no such links.
HNI (15% of IPO) category is divided into two sub category for applying and allotments : Small HNI with 5% size reservation and Big HNI with 10% size.

SHNI category means 2 to 10 lakh amount application means 14 to 66 lots here.
BHNI means above 10 lakh amount application means 67 and more lots here.

@Lokes Sir,

Thanks for the good explanation.

@Lokes In Zerodha i see only "Individual Investor" category! How you applied HNI application? I only use ASBA for HNI.

@ Lokes, your sHNI figures appear to be quite an underestimate.
For 165 cr IPO, NII portion 24.75 cr. Amount subscribed 24.75× 15.66= 387 cr.
sHNI portion= 8.25cr. bHNI= 16.5cr.
1× sHNI applications, = 412
1× bHNI applications allotment wise= 825
Taking your figures for higher value:-
8× sHNI ; applications = ~ 3300
Amount subscribed = 66 cr.
bHNI = 2.5× ; applications =~ 2060
Amount = 206cr.
Total amount 272 cr. Way below 387cr.

My estimate of subscription:-
sHNI 18× , applications = ~7400
Amount = 148 cr
bHNI ~3× , applications = 2400
Amount 240 cr
Total Amount 240+148= 388cr.
Matches with subscription amount. Minor variation may be there due to some individuals bidding higher amount than minimum. But that won't be very significant.
Taking these figures allotment chance:-
sHNI = 1:18;
bHNI = 1:3.

@TrueInfo

It should be, as per me
N * 1 (SHNI) + N * 5 (BHNI) = 15.6. (Actual)

N is number of times
Considering Conditions , 1) no rejection
2) All applied minimum amount.
Figures will change, on change of condition.

so if bhni is 2 times ( for example)
shni will me = 15.6 - 2*5 = 5.6

your figures not looking correct
18 (shni) + 3* 5 (bhni) is not equal to 15.6.

@Gaurav, by your logic if sHNI is subscribed 15.66 times, there will be no subscription in bHNI. I suppose your equation is not correct. Imagine ideal conditions, both segments are subscribed 15.66 times. Will the net subscription not be 15.66, because each one is subscribed in the same ratio. In that case the sum of both will be more than 31.

@ColdBurger: you can check this. I have replied here.
https://www.chittorgarh.com/ipo/ipo_discussions.asp?a=1248&c=514451&ap=0

@TrueInfo: you numbers are based on your this line: "Minor variation may be there due to some individuals bidding higher amount than minimum."
And i have taken "more" consideration in above instead of your "some" since i feel still many people don't know about rules properly so many are applying more than minimum lots in both categories in good ipos (with good subscriptions) too. So it all depends on how much that "more" goes to "some" , then in same way it will go towards your estimates :)
I still think here it will be around 10-12X max application wise in SHNI and 2.5-3X application wise in BHNI, considering not much have applied in other lots after seeing in campus etc. There might be many non approvals also in SHNI due to upi requests.

My prediction of SHNI= 8-10x
For. BHNI= 2x

@ Noorul bhai, (mere vichar se atyadhik sammanit sadasya of this forum along with few others) ; thoda aage badhiye. 25% tak toh badh hi sakte hain. Itne subscription mein shayad NII 15.66× ke paise pure nahin ho payenge.

SEBI wants us to play blind, and here we are are... but how long. ?

Does anybody has idea when shni and bhi subscription wise breakup will be made available.?

@ Trueinfo.. I know according to that estimate it will not going to meet above subscription figures.. but my prediction is based on the logic that still good number of people aren't aware of the new rule and they r putting Big applications, Some people deliberately putting Big application in both hni category in aim of higher allocation on proporsnate basis (if undersubscribe) and there r few % of people who think big amount of application will get some kind of advantage even in lottery :) .

Well the truth is we all can only make wild guesses... Let's see how close we can guess to the real numbers . Even in future if Sebi will display the subscription number of both the HNI categories separately .. still we won't b able to figure out the exact ratio becaz we don't know how big the size of there applications are..

Actually Sebi wants us to play a casino... Where we ride only on our sixth sense.. TBH I m loving it ..

Sir
Kya small HNI UPI apply through upi

Suppose big HNI application wise subscription is 3x, everyone will get min 2L worth shares, right?

In small HNI its 40:497 means 12.4X application wise
In Big HNI its 167:412 means 2.52X application wise.
Its near to figures mentioned in my comment no. 10 above.

Retail: 103:1111 means 10.78X application wise final.

Is the last date for accepting mandate today or Monday?

It's Tuesday 12pm

@smile,
This issue listing performance has nothing to do with LIC listing,LIC may list in fiscount 90% people knew,still people bhar bhar ke paisa lagaya,specially small size T2T stocks has its own listing dynamics,perhaps u have seen what happened to Rainbow,people used to say Rainbow listing would depend on Campus debut,but Campus had a fabulous listing whereas Rainbow collapsed even after listing.

Stock market is a place of surprise,this beast is tough to tame,,operator activity is rampant here,I admit that sentiment has certainly a role in listing,but still each stocks has it's own fundamental,valuation and dynamics,
Thanks

open prostocks demat for minor, it is best in industry as of now...

Thanks K.Atar for your response.
How about bank account? How do we apply BHNI lots if Demat and Bank account are not connected.

Sorry I'm bit unclear on this, hence asking.

@Lokes, I know you have minor account. How do you manage BHNI applications? Appreciate your response

Regd. ICICI,

Students below 18 years of age (minors) may open demat accounts, but they may not open trading accounts, and therefore such students cannot purchase and sell share market securities.

Minors may not enter into any trades because of the Indian Contract Act of 1872 that prohibits minors from entering into any contracts. Since share trading involves - contracts between a broker and a client, minors are not allowed to open a trading account.

Demat accounts can be opened in the name of a minor child only by the natural guardian (parents) or court-appointed guardians. Minors below 18 can also open their account through their parents or guardians and buy and sell stocks thru parents.

I use Guardian linked axis bank account, (i can swap balances easily), there i make. application normally by asba (if required). And till now have not faced any problem. (Got allotted in Sawarj Suitings and LeMerit - Recently).

K.Atar "I use Guardian linked axis bank account, (i can swap balances easily), there i make. application normally by asba (if required). And till now have not faced any problem.
What all restrictions apply to the minor's account? Minors cant trade, how do you manage?

@Hello Roshan M,
you asked the genuine question...

(i) Some DPs don't allow selling on listing day etc. BUT prostocks allows it. So go for it as their cust.service is also very helpful, they give time and guide and solve the queries.
(ii) for bank, i checked and found axis bank suitable to my need (there are other banks too but I don't have experience in it so can't comment), in many banks if you open minor account then they don't give internet banking and atm card (have heard that AU small bank gives internet banking), in my linked account i swap balance whenever need be (when applying sme and after selling SME as you know, amount comes in minor account and we can't withdraw that much amount from minor SO i easily swap the balance (minor to my account 🤗) and re-route to my main UNION bank account (which is my oldest trusted account), and this (prostocks/Axis) combination has worked upto now smoothly, SO no complaints untill now.
**IF YOY HAVE FURTHER QUESTIONS, PLEASE FEEL FREE TO ASK.

Thanks.

@K.Athar thanks for many details.
Coming to Banks, does ICICI or HDFC provides all the services or Axis bank is the best.

I'm planning to open one Minor account and just looking best possible combination of Demat/Trading and Bank account?

Bcoz Prostocks doesn't allow buying NSE SME IPOs.....

Hi Suneel,
I had hdfc, icici and sbi nearby my area but they all were giving me hard time for opening minor account and so i chose axis (nearby), axis allows 5 application (3rd party), and i apply asba (if subs are good) and by upi (edelweiss - if subs are so so),
For exchange related - Got allotted in Sawarj Suitings (NSE), (sold it already🙄) /LeMerite (NSE). I do any secondary purchase from my account only, I don't do it with minor account.. I am facing no problem as such, but it is wise for you to get more responses from other friends who have minor account. You should check with banks in your nearby (like AU, Bandhan, IDFC and yes bank), may be they can provide minor standalone netbanking facility.

@Suneel , @K.Atar and others,

I have minor account with Prostocks and no doubt they are very much suitable for minors' account. I can buy/sell shares (intraday i haven't tried and no options trading. And we don't need that either) . I use only for IPO application for my kids name. Even tried for buyback. All good with Prostocks.

Coming to bank, Most of other banks need parent's account as well. I all ready had HDFC bank account so went for minor's account with HDFC bank without exploring other options. But they don't provide DebitCard and independent internet banking. My kids account is attached to my internet banking and so i can easily operate and move funds as require.

Coming to IPO application, can't do an UPI application because not able to create UPI ID for kids account. I think it is not allowed per rules.
I apply through SBI ASBA, but they close sharp at 2:00PM which is little early to decide some time and some time I miss the time due to work. but don't have any other option. Still looking for better option on banking part.

Thanks NKJ for very valuable information.
One question, when you have your kids Minor account in HDFC, why do you SBi ASBA to apply IPOs?

It's better to do through HDFC ASBA right? Am I missing something?

@suneel: yes i am having prostocks demat account for my minor kid. I was using hdfc bank account for that. I opened hdfc bank account for minor where guardian account was already there. And i used to apply in retail applications only via yes bank or RBL bank third party asba.

And hdfc bank didn't used to allow to apply for minor using hdfc asba, it used to show only guardian pan card, so @nkj also mentioned applying using other bank.

But recently hdfc bank started allowing for ipo applying using minor pan card also. While applying ipo, option is there to start applying using minor/guardian bank account. Currently my minor bank account is showing guardian PAN only even when i gave minor pan card also during account opening 6 months back but they added guardian pan only in minor bank account. So on friday i gave request to change minor pan card in minor account by visiting branch. They said it will be done in 4-5 days. After that only, i can apply in ipo using minor hdfc bank asba. And yes upi id is not possible for minors as per rule.

Thanks Lokes for great level of details.
I also have HDFC Bank account where I apply all my IPOs using HDFC sec. As per your suggestion, I will go with Prostocks and HDFC Bank Minor account.

One last question, for both Prostocks and Bank Minor account, should I use my phone number or do I need to take new phone number for Minor also?

Appreciate all your details.

@suneel: guardian mobile number and email id needed for minor demat and bank account. My wife is guardian and having hdfc bank account, so her mobile number and email id were being used.
And in prostocks, guardian demat account with them is not needed, we can just open minor account also, giving both minor/guardian documents. you can read more here: https://www.prostocks.com/trading/minor-account.html

And may be you can wait for some days, until i can confirm you after tying next week, when my minor kid pan card is linked to her minor hdfc bank account and i am able to apply ipo for her too from her minor hdfc bank asba.

Thanks @Lokes.
I will wait for your feedback before I proceed with HDFC Minor account

Thanks again for all details.

@lokes,
Yes, By default HDFC ASBA takes parent's PAN even when select minor's account. I also thought to update PAN in minor's account. But somewhere I read that PAN number is taken from Internet banking Profile details so I gave up the idea of updating PAN for minor's bank account.
Also, account holder's name in minor's account is " U/G ". Not sure if this matter for IPO application? Any Idea?

Will wait for your update. Appreciate your helping gesture !!

@Suneel,
Let me tell you one more thing.
Minor's demat account opening with Prostocks is not fully online. It involves online application submission and then they check your form and send you pdf. You need to take printout and other formalities and then courier the form to them along with required doc/Xerox.
I would suggest you get in touch with their support and understand everything. Sometimes you need to follow up with them but overall experience is good.

@ NKJ - I am also using Prostocks for my Minor account . Every things seems to be smooth with Prostocks except some . The Maximum limit of transaction for minor account is 5L and if your trade exceeds that , then the order will be rejected .( I have NRL in my minor account and when i tried placing sell order @ 245 *2200 last month , it got rejected and i have to transfer the shares using easiest to major account . Also Prostocks does not allow intraday trades in Minor account.

intraday is nowhere allowed in minor account.

@c.dinesh,
I was not aware of such limitation on 5L. I only use my kids account for IPO and never got such big allotment. Thanks for posting it here. Did you try to sell 1-1 lot order to bring it less than 5L per order?

Still its rare case for me at least. And I have set up easiest. So I transfer shares to my account unless i sell on listing day.
Still Prostocks is worth it. Some brokers don't even allow to sell or don't open trading account.

Yes, Intraday and FNO are not allowed in minor's account as per rules.

Orders less than 5L will go through fine. my case of NRL was single lot (2200 * 246) and it was rejected with error message as minor limit as 5L, cant sell below 2200 last month. now lot size has reduced to 1100.

@suneel @NKJ: i am able to apply for ipo, after PAN changed, from my minor kid hdfc bank account asba. Only thing is bank account name shows as "baby name U/G mother name" so no idea if that will create some issue or not.
Link intime is registrar in both eMudhra and Aether, and that don't give any reason for un-successul allotment, Kfintech atleast mention reason if its rejected due to some technical issue etc. I have applied in eMudhra now.
Missed to check in ethos for trial purpose where registrar was kfintech.

Thanks for keeping us informed @lokes.
I went to bank last week but initially they said that it can't be done as it is minor's account and guardians PAN only can be linked. When I asked them to check in once again they said they will check and get back. I visited again on Friday but still haven't heard anything.

Do you have "Kids Advantage Savings Account" or normal savings account?
Which form did you fill? They where not saying anything about form to me.

I doubt "U/G" in name should matter in IPO application, but pls keep us informed if you get any allotment/rejection.

@lokes & @NKJ, for my daughter's icici account also having U/G. But when i apply thru ASBA, they providing an option to give the name correction for IPO applications. But for every time you need to edit the U/G and apply.

I am having ICICI young star account for my minor daughter. They are providing Debit Card and ASBA facilities. I am also having ICICI account, where i linked my daughters account. Since both accounts got linked, its easy for me to transfer money from my account to her account and vice versa, From the online account i cant select either mine or her account or else from both accounts to apply for the IPO. Debit card also working fine.
Regarding Demat, using Prostocks. Using it for more than 3 years. It works fine. Able to sell it on listing day itself.
Regarding Income Tax, any one of the parent need to include this profit or loss in their e-filing.

@NKJ: intially during account opening, they link guardian PAN only with minor bank account (even when i gave them minor PAN card too), later you can give them minor pan card photocopy with guardian sign to update in minor bank account, they will do that in 3 days normally (they say 6-7 days). its normal savings account for my minor daughter in hdfc bank asba. Techincal rejection we will come to know with kfintech only or if allotted in link intime then we will come to know its accepted, else need to drop a mail to linktime etc. i have applied for Emudhra ipo from her minor hdfc bank asba in retail 1 lot, lets see.

In hdfc bank, name edit is not allowed in ipo application, i tried, it was coming as pre-filled and not editable. And regarding income tax, minor income need to show along with that parent who has higher income, not with any of parent.

very informatice thread...thank you

Thanks Lokes for more details. Missed this thread

@Prabhahar,
It seems you are using ICICI Minor account with ASBA to apply for IPOs using Prostocks.

Can you confirm if you are able to get any HNi allocations using ICICI minor account?

Appreciate your response

This is very informatic thread , others also please join and share if any other bank account can be used for minor to apply IPO.
Is SBI or Kotak allow ?

My understanding is as following, if any change then let me know.
1. Minor above 15 years are allowed to use UPI
2. Minor above 10 can have SB account with debit card in many banks (ASBA will works)
3. Minor below 10 years, only option is third-party application

Nil